Riverside organic seo lead gener mar 28, 2024 001 karl hudson’s studio 1
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What Does “Riverside organic seo lead gener mar 28, 2024 001 karl hudson's studio 1” Talk About?
This episode of the James Dooley Podcast features a conversation between host James Dooley and Dan Grant, Director at FatRank and PromoSEO, focused on organic SEO as a lead generation strategy. The two discuss why SEO-driven leads tend to convert at higher rates than social media advertising, explaining that organic search captures high-intent users who are actively seeking a product or service rather than being interrupted by ads on platforms like Facebook or Instagram. Dan also breaks down the two core pillars of ranking on Google, namely quality content and high-authority backlinks, while emphasising that both require significant investment and specialist knowledge to execute properly.
The conversation moves into the broader challenges businesses face when attempting SEO on their own, including the time it takes to build topical authority, the technical demands of website speed and conversion optimisation, and the unpredictability of Google's algorithm. James notes that while PPC can generate leads immediately, SEO is a longer-term strategy, and both outperform social media for lead quality. The episode also touches on why many UK businesses struggle to get results from DIY SEO efforts, often underestimating the complexity involved.
In the final segment, Dan explains FatRank's pay-on-conversion lead generation model, which removes all upfront financial risk from the client. Rather than charging for leads, FatRank funds the website build, content, links, and optimisation themselves, only collecting a finder's fee once the client converts a job. James stresses that the model is selective, requiring clients who can respond quickly to enquiries, deliver good service, and maintain competitive pricing, ensuring both parties benefit from a sustainable arrangement.
“People who are able to rank websites and they're familiar with manipulating Google's algorithm, familiar with writing good sales copy, having a quick responsive website that's good and converts well with the right call to actions. If you know all of that and you're able to actually do SEO properly and do it well and rank websites, then it can work really well.”
— Dan Grant
Who Are the Guests on “Riverside organic seo lead gener mar 28, 2024 001 karl hudson's studio 1”?
James Dooley is a seasoned SEO professional and entrepreneur known for building and scaling lead generation businesses across the UK. As the host of the James Dooley Podcast, he regularly shares practical insights on digital marketing, SEO strategy, and performance-based business models. His work with FatRank has positioned him as a prominent voice in the UK SEO community, particularly around innovative monetisation models like pay-on-conversion lead generation.
Dan Grant serves as Director at FatRank and PromoSEO, bringing over 11 to 12 years of hands-on experience in organic SEO, content strategy, and multi-channel digital marketing. His expertise spans the full spectrum of lead generation, from technical on-site optimisation and backlink building to paid social campaigns and PPC. Dan is particularly focused on helping businesses grow without the upfront financial risk typically associated with SEO investment.
What Are the Key Takeaways From “Riverside organic seo lead gener mar 28, 2024 001 karl hudson's studio 1”?
Here are the key points discussed in this episode:
- Organic SEO generates higher-converting leads than social media advertising because users are actively searching for a product or service rather than being passively interrupted by ads.
- The two most critical factors for ranking on Google are high-quality, niche-relevant content with strong internal linking and authoritative external backlinks that avoid spammy sources.
- SEO is a long-term strategy that requires significant investment in technical optimisation, topical authority, and conversion-focused design, making it unsuitable for businesses looking for quick results.
- FatRank's pay-on-conversion model eliminates upfront financial risk entirely by funding website build, content, links, and optimisation costs, only charging clients a finder's fee after a job is converted.
- A holistic digital marketing strategy that combines organic SEO, PPC, Facebook ads, and pay-on-conversion lead generation creates more resilient growth than relying on any single acquisition channel.
“With our pay-on-conversion model, we don't charge clients for the leads at all. Leads are completely free. We front the cost of the website, the links, the content, the optimisation and the ranking. It's not until they convert a job that they pay.”
— Dan Grant
Is “Riverside organic seo lead gener mar 28, 2024 001 karl hudson's studio 1” Worth Listening To?
This episode is a genuinely practical listen for anyone trying to understand the real mechanics and true costs of organic SEO before committing budget to it. Rather than offering vague encouragement, James and Dan give honest context about why so many businesses fail at DIY SEO, including the underestimated complexity of backlinks, topical authority, and algorithm sensitivity. The contrast drawn between SEO, PPC, and social media advertising is particularly useful, helping listeners understand where each channel fits within a broader growth strategy.
What makes this episode stand out is the detailed explanation of FatRank's pay-on-conversion model, which challenges the conventional assumption that lead generation always requires significant upfront spend. For business owners currently paying for leads through platforms like Checkatrade or Bark, or those burning budget on SEO without seeing results, the framework Dan and James describe offers a compelling and low-risk alternative. The conversation is concise, experience-backed, and avoids the hype that often surrounds SEO content online.
Who Should Listen to “Riverside organic seo lead gener mar 28, 2024 001 karl hudson's studio 1”?
This episode is ideal for:
- Small to medium-sized UK business owners looking to generate more leads without taking on upfront financial risk
- Digital marketing professionals and SEO practitioners wanting to understand how performance-based lead generation models work in practice
- Entrepreneurs currently spending on Facebook ads or PPC who want to understand how organic SEO compares in terms of lead quality and conversion
- Tradespeople or service-based businesses currently using platforms like Checkatrade or Bark who are exploring more cost-effective lead generation alternatives
Where Can You Listen to James Dooley Podcast?
You can listen to James Dooley Podcast on all major podcast platforms:
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What Are Listeners Saying About This Episode?
“Really refreshing to hear an honest breakdown of why SEO is so difficult rather than the usual hype. The explanation of content and backlinks as the two core ranking factors was clear and actionable. The pay-on-conversion model discussion at the end genuinely made me reconsider how I approach lead generation for my business.”
“I've been burned before investing in SEO that never delivered results, so hearing James and Dan explain exactly why that happens was almost validating. The point about topical authority and why one article and one backlink won't cut it is something every business owner needs to hear before spending a penny.”
“The comparison between organic SEO and interruption marketing on social media was the highlight for me. It perfectly explains why leads from Google searches convert so much better. Short episode but genuinely packed with useful insight for anyone trying to grow a service business online.”
James Dooley So I've got Dan Grant, the director at FatRank and PromoSEO, and today's video is about organic SEO and using SEO strategies to generate leads and whether you think this is a good strategy or not. Dan Grant Yes, so I think organic SEO is one of them where it can definitely work really well if you know what you're doing. People who are able to rank websites and they're familiar with manipulating Google's algorithm, familiar with writing good sales copy, having a quick responsive website that's good and converts well with the right call to actions. If you know all of that and you're able to actually do SEO properly and do it well and rank websites, then it can work really well. Where people come a bit unstuck with it is I think they think they can just throw a website up. They'll use something like Wix or WordPress or whatever it is and throw a website up quickly and obviously without that experience and know-how within Google it's really hard to rank and get those enquiries initially. So it does require a bit of specialist knowledge. It's definitely something that can work but I think there are probably easier alternatives for people who are trying to just generate good quality leads than going down the SEO route, because people don't realise how daunting it actually is to rank organically within Google. There are just so many factors involved, from ranking the website to backlinks and powering them up. There's a big cost involved, so people don't take that fully into account and then they struggle to generate the leads they thought they would. James Dooley For sure. Personally I think generating SEO leads via organic SEO strategies is a lot better than social media like Facebook ads, Twitter, Instagram and places like that. Mainly because it's not interruption marketing. They've had to go out of their way to create a search in Google. They've had to think about needing this product or service, they've gone out of their way to create the search to find someone for that product or service. For that reason, in comparison to social media ads lead generation, the conversion seems to be a lot higher. The downside to it is like you said, there are lots of different ranking factors to physically try to rank the website. So just talk us through one or two, with regards to ranking websites. If you've got 30 seconds of explaining how to rank a website, try and explain how you rank a website high up in Google to try to be ranking for the big keywords. Dan Grant Obviously a very condensed version of this because there are so many factors, but typically the main areas are content and backlinks. Having really good relevant content that's going to rank well in Google, content that is tailored towards your niche, content that has internal linking powering it up. Then from an external perspective, you need high quality relevant backlinks pointing to you as well. You don't want spammy links. That holistic approach of content and links done properly does cost a lot of money. Sometimes people think if they do a one-page article and build a link to it they'll rank, but it's just not the case. There's a lot more that goes into the algorithm. So generally they're the two biggest factors in terms of ranking on Google. James Dooley And then obviously from there, once you are ranking, you've still got to make certain you've got a website that's fast. You've got to make certain it's built for conversion from a design point of view with the right call to actions in place. You need to make certain the content is not only well-written for NLP optimisation, entities and concise formatting that Google likes, but it's also good enough from a sales copy point of view for the user to trust the website and want to enquire. Plus it's not just about a single page. You need topical authority, so you need lots of pages written on the topic to try and rank. It's not a short-term win. PPC I could set up today and generate leads today, but it's costly. It's also costly trying to rank SEO. SEO is a longer-term strategy, but PPC and SEO do seem to yield better results than social media. But talk a little now about how we've moved away from just doing organic SEO. We're a holistic digital marketing company that looks at every angle: Facebook ads, Twitter ads, Instagram ads, YouTube ads, PPC and organic SEO. Explain our pay-on-conversion lead generation strategy and whether you feel that's better than an organic SEO lead generation strategy. Dan Grant Well, as you said, we do a holistic approach where we cover all angles for our clients. We generate leads not just from organic but from Facebook ads, PPC and other areas, which is important. For people doing organic for the first time who aren't specialists, they put a lot of money and time into it without any guarantee of results. We’ve been doing organic SEO for 11–12 years, so we have that experience. With our pay-on-conversion model, we don't charge clients for the leads at all. Leads are completely free. We front the cost of the website, the links, the content, the optimisation and the ranking. It's not until they convert a job that they pay. If you're a company comparing options, you could learn SEO – it might take two or three years to understand ranking, you have to save budget, invest it and still have no guarantee of leads. With us, we guarantee the leads, we front the cost and it's risk-free. In the current climate that's very important because companies want to cut costs while trying to grow. So it's a no-brainer. James Dooley It's very important for anyone watching this to understand that we are selective with who we choose on our pay-on-conversion model because we have to make certain you're good enough to service our leads. If we're generating leads and you're not getting back to the person for two, three or four days, that affects conversion rate and that affects us because we only get paid on conversion. So you need a sales team or someone who will jump on enquiries quickly. You need to provide a good service. You need to be competitive on price. Not the cheapest, but good value with room for profit for both sides. We’re not doing it for free. If you get a conversion you add a finder's fee for us. We are completely de-risking everything of what we do. If you're watching this and you're ranking organically or buying leads from Checkatrade or Bark or wherever, leave a comment. Also click the link to check out our pay-on-conversion lead generation model.
Creators & Guests
Host
James Dooley is a UK entrepreneur.